Primetime exclusive tonight: Joe Vega, a close family friend of missing 6-year-old Isabel Celis' family speaks out regarding the newly released 911 calls and Isabel's dad being barred from seeing his family.
The Peruvian defense attorney who reportedly planned to step aside as Joran van der Sloot’s lawyer, will stay on the case, HLN’s Nancy Grace has learned.
In an exclusive phone interview, Maximo Altez told a Nancy Grace producer he is back on the case. Altez added that he and other lawyers will continue to represent van der Sloot, the 22-year-old from Aruba held on murder charges in a prison outside Lima, Peru.
Asked if he had considered quitting the case because of personal threats, Altez declined to answer.
In addition to his alleged confession in the beating death of Stephany Flores, van der Sloot is the lead suspect in the disappearance of 18-year-old Alabama high school student Natalee Holloway five years ago on her senior class trip.
Van der Sloot has allegedly told authorities he attacked Flores after she read an e-mail on his computer connected to the Holloway case.
But police have reportedly said they believe he killed her to steal her poker winnings at the Lima casino where they met.
A hearing is set for next week. No trial date has been announced. In Peru, a panel of judges decides murder cases.
Nancy has shared her family photos. Now it's your turn! Send in a family photo, and it could be featured on a special segment on "Nancy Grace." Click on the iReport logo to send us your story!
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i believe that natalee holloway was a victim of her own bad judgement. I beleieve she drank and partied too much on that last night in aruba as do hundreds maybe even thousands have done over the last decade in many locations,i think that his first or seciond story to the police that she was shaking and seizing..was a sign of alcohol poisoning.and she died ..he was frightened called his dad because of an upcoming appointed to be a judge,did not want to deal with it,and got rid of the body or had joran and his friends do it..he was just 17 at the time was going to school played on sports teams and was a good student..you and the hollways and the never ending press coverage calling him a murderer.. now you and dr frankenstein have created the monster... murderer.... enjoy your creation and all the press time it will get..
I belive he is innocent holloway should have been in her hotel roomwith her class mates not out at a bar shesnot even legal drinking age
Its to bad for the Mom of this creep that she is in such denial her son is a sociopath, she borrowed money from friends supposedly to pay for a attorney,there is no way a attorney can help him, she be better off to not have done that,she will have to wake up some day and realize what he is, no matter how heartbreaking that is.
I have utmost respect for Mr. Altez for staying on as Sloot's counsel. It may be hard for many to understand but defense lawyers serve to help those who are often beyond help. They try to provide reason and impartial protection to those who have no one else between them and the lynch mob. Yes, it seems that Sloot had done terrible things, and I have tremendous sympathy for the victims and the families involved. But the press and the Peruvian officials have helped create a mass hysteria in this case that threatens to undermine the whole process. Just read the blogs and you see that people have lost all sense of reason and proportion. There is an unhealthy obsession with prison rape, torture, and murder. The truth is, regardless of what he's done, Mr. Sloot is a human being and in our civilized society we have, through history, established standards for the treatment of people who are accused of terrible crimes. These standards are to protect not just the accused de jour – but to protect all of us from the threat of false convictions and torture. Don't people understand that by giving in to our worst inclinations towards violence and hatred we lower ourselves to the moral level of those we condemn? It is certainly not easy, but these are exactly the times when it is most important to remember that true justice is tempered with reason and compassion – not blind revenge.
He was not a good student; fellow students said he was not only tardy often but would come to school hungover.
The Dutch/Aruban government probably PAID Maximo MORE MONEY to stay on for the time being. It's all about money for services, money for goods, money for 'privileges', money for media.
Social Democracies PAY and BAN TOGETHER to protect one of their own, no matter the accusations.
Nancy,
I have been following the Van Der Sloot case, since Natalie Hollway disappeared.
Upon following this new murder case, of Stephanie Flores, I think Joran Van Der Sloot entised Stephanie to go to his hotel room by saying they could play on-line poker.
I f you look at the expression (Smirk) on Van Der Sloot's face, when he picks up his room key, from the hotel clerk, and plays with it, it appears to me that the look was insinuating "I'm getting lucky tonight."
I think he brought Stephanie back to his hotel room with expectations of seducing her, prior to robbing her.
Van Der Sloot picked Natalie up, took her to the beach and seduced her. She has not been seen in 5 years.
I think both girls rejected or tried to fight off his advances, sending him into a rage, which ultimately lead to both girls meeting the horrible end we have heard about .....
Thank you for all the work you do to help victimes and their families.
Has anyone questioned whether Joran has the same syndrome as Heleigh Cummings? Isn't the ears being so low on the head an indicator?
Can HLN please focus on something besides the van der Sloot story? Or even something in addition to the van der Sloot story?
he should fry but not til the good old US of A get a chance at him i hope he gets raped beaten and torchered everyday so he knows how it feels....
I cant believe anyone would think of defending this creep in any way shape or form..He has lied over and over so why would you assume that his story of her jerking and seizuring would be true..So I suppose the brutal murder of the other girl is justified by something else as well because she trusted him so I guess it was her bad judgement right Nadine..No I think not!! I think he killed Natalie as well and we will never know until her remains are found and can be autopsied..If he was innocent in Natalies death and had nothing to do with it, then why would he have had his dad help him dispose of her body as if she were trash?? Second with his dad being so high up in power dont you think if his son was truely innocent he would have said lets call the police and let them do as they need instead of lets hide her body..Doesnt add up!!He is cruel and heartless and a waste of human flesh..He deserves anything that may come his way in prison..As sad as it would be for his mother but not for most others i would def not shed any tears if he contracted a deadly infection in the what appears to be unsanitary prison in Peru..He took 2 innocent lives.. And most likely if he gets out in a few years he would kill some other young girl because he knows he will find a way around it..
Question...what about that interview he did a few years back where he said that a man from Venezuela offered to pay him 10k if he brought him a blond girl...in the interview he goes on to say he say he took her to the beach where the man and a boat were waiting...and that she was taken away in a boat after 1am sometime. He also said that he had been shorted and only got $9,400.00...which he also stated that he gave 'those brothers' a $1000.00 apiece. Could it be that maybe Natalee is alive somewhere??? My heart goes out to her Mother, I am sure she is always wondering if she could be out there. God bless both the girls and their families...in my heart I still want Nat found............
Castro Castro is faking it. I am a peruvian native and can say it is all fake. There is no such thing as a clean cell there. It is all for shows. I am 100 % sure all those prisoners that were interviewed were threatened before the reporters got there. They cleaned the cell so no country can say that his human rights were violated. It is all a joke. Peruvians can care less about the prisoners, they are the least of their worries; hunger, poverty, unemployment, lack of water in the cities are the main problems. They just have to look right internationally. Before this case, no american had a clue where Peru was, now everybody is an expert. On the other hand, how can experts/lawyers can say that he will be extradited. Come'n. He committed a crime in Peru, he was caught in Peru, he will be convicted there, and he will serve his sentence there. Aruba does not have a chance, until he serves his sentence in Peru.No matter what he did in other countries, they will just have to wait their turn. I think everybody needs to understand International Law and Van Der Sloot is just one more criminal with a lot of attention. Peruvians can care less.He will not go to Aruba.
This guy is a complete idiot – Give me 5 min. with Joran. Nothing but a psychotic, lying loser, that needs to get life. If not there – the US should just go over and take em. Why?
Cuz We send people on cruises over there, Advertise on T.V. for them, like we dont know the corruption that goes on? US needs to wake up, put some "boots" on and walk over there. Its the only way to get Justice here. He is to blame for Holloways death in Americas eyes, (enough of the head games) We seen everything we need. Natalie was an American and the US needs to get Justice for its People. Anywhere else hes getting off the hook as far as im concerned. Unless Peru has anything to say bout that?
How does the "former" lawyer(Maximo Altez) even able to represent him now after all the accusations on him? Seems to me he should have charges brought against him too? Holding evidence/information on the Holloway case or any involvment for that matter? This Lawyer is as guilty as Joran.
How bout Joran now may be involved with 2 others Missing from the same place he had a "candy shop" – looks like hes got a gambling issue, always needs money and runs his little "candy shop" selling women. Worse then that – killing. Hes targeting women from other countries, should be some sort of terrorism?
Going back to my game on Facebook "Mafia Wars" – Just had to get that off my chest.
I know this has nothing to do with the lawyer topic...
I just watched tonight's show, and about 34 minutes into it while Jean Casarez is walking around in the prison yard, they show someone on one of the upper floors sticking his hand out the window with a giant knife cutting a rope or something, then they change to a pair of scissors! I watched the rerun at 10 pm just to check my eyes!
Good luck Joran!! Hope you make it to trial!
Yeah, Nadine Diem...he was just a great guy before that Jezabel came along and ruined his life. Are you kidding?
Van der Sloot attorneys and family at work already! Just saw the video of his cell at this time. It is no better or I think no worse (did not get to see any other cells) that the inmates at the prison! When you are a GUEST in another country you must abide by their laws and systems. Van der Sloot has committed 2 murders and he says he scared for his life! EXCUSE what about the 2 young women he killed! They were probably very scared and begging for their lives also but it did not stop him! He wants to Aruba! Forget it until your sentence in Peru is completely done and I hope you the 35 years that is possible.
Great coverage by Jean Casarez at Castro Castro. Couldn't help but notice the very large knife in possession of one of the arms hanging out of the upper floor of the prison. I believe (but can't be sure) it was when she was talking about the inmates doing laundry. The guy had red sleeves and was cutting a rope strung between two windows with bars. Scary!
No one, I mean NO one deserves to have that happen, young women shouldnt have to fear going out to drink, don't make the predators out to be the victims. And as for others creating a monster, he's not the victim, lets be clear, its the two ladies and their families that are left to mourn that are the victims, not him.
If he is a victim of bad press, sadly its of his own doing.
I WISH YOUR SITE HAD A BIG BUTTON ON THE HOME PAGE THAT SAYS: TALK ABOUT OR LEAVE A MESSAGE ABOUT THE PROGRAM GOING ON RIGHT NOW WITH NANCY GRACE. IT TOOK ME A LONG TIME TO GET TO THIS PLACE AND I AM STILL NOT SURE IF THIS IS WHERE I SHOULD LEAVE THIS COMMENT AND I STILL WANT TO COMMENT ON THE CURRENT DISCUSSION BUT WON'T BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS THE RIGHT PLACE TO LEAVE IT.
DOES HE HAVE BROTHERS, SISTERS, COUSINS OR ANY FAMILY THAT EVER HAD ANY REASON TO BELIEVE THAT HE WAS DANGEROUS? WERE THERE ANY SIGNS HE WAS A THREATENING PERSON?
Why did you waste time reporting on the prison where van der Sloot's now residing? Who really cares? It wouldn't matter to me if he was in shackels, under a piece of canvas.
I agree with the other comment about Miss Holloway and her behavior; she was just another of many young women who think because their families have a little bit of money that the rules don't apply and that there won't be any consequences.
Natalee and her friends left their room after they were supposed to be in their room for the night, they were out with guys that they didn't know, Natalee's friends left her alone with strangers and she disappeared because of her bad decisions, so tell me who's really to blame for her disappearance? Is it the guy who everyone is trying to convict for her murder (even though there's no dead body)? Is it Natalee's friends for not making sure she went back to the hotel with them? Is it the unattentive chapperones that didn't make sure the students stayed in their rooms? Or is it Natalee's own fault for making some very bad life choices?
For all we know, she may be in some Shieks harram and enjoying it as a sex slave! Has anyone thought about that?
Let's get back to worrying about the children that are missing or hurt and didn't make a bad life decision, yet they are missing or dead by no fault of their own.
Please forgive my rant, but I feel that there's far too much time spent on reporting stupid people that make stupid decisions.
He made his own decisions. I used to believe the alcohol poisoning theory, until he admitted that he bashed this girl in the face with his elbow, strangled her til he broke her neck but didn't kill her, and finished her with his t-shirt. Then I realized that my previous presumption was less likely correct. Of course, it's all presumption – EXCEPT for the fact that in the end he had a choice. He made the one to do all of the above.
I have somewhat mixed feelings about your coverage of Van Der Sloot. First of all, you've made him into a celebrity. So, if he has nothing else, he still has that. Don't assume it means nothing to, essentially, a kid. The whole prison report today gives him celebrity status,certainly in jail.
Then, many on the show appear to not only be fine with the idea of him getting raped in jail, but actually would see it as some sick form of justice. Excuse me? You even appear to be one of them. Are you really going to tell the world that rape is fine in jail, but a crime outside of it? A crime is a crime, girl. You can't condemn it in one place, and condone it in the other.
As to my earlier point, I'm not blaming the media. They do their job. But we all know that there is a point where coverage becomes 'paparrazi'. And VDS, in my opinion, could meet that standard. If possible, could an expert on your show tell us to what extent his worldwide fame could have given this kid an identity that he may, perhaps, not have embraced if his crimes had remained more anonymous?
Here's a chilling thought: what if he killed Stephanie because he knew it would make him a worldwide celebrity? What if he no longer cared about the manner in which the world would perceived him, because half the world already perceived him as a murderer?
adding to above comment:
What if your coverage of his every act as this drama unfolds before our eyse is the true motive for the murder?
I know. It seems absurd. But we're not talking about a normal thinking human being. He is a master manipulator. And I believe he may have manipulated the media into doing exactly what he wanted them to do.
Finally, Karma has caught up with him and what comes around, goes around. When they put this murderer in general population, I give it a week and he'll be dead.
To the poster who blames Natalee, are you so pathetic you need to
defend this idiot? Who cares if he WAS a good student, athlete, etcc.,
he intentionallly covered up a death with his dad and murdered
at least one other girl, crawl back in you hole while this punk
gets what he deserves!
I agree PARTIALLY with Nadine. Whether Natalee's death was an accident (a fall, alcohol poisoning, a roofie given to her), or murder/manslaughter, I don't understand how her friends - who saw her drive off with THREE men - didn't try to stop her, didn't call the trip counselors, or security, to stop her. Both Natalee and her friends acted extremely, extremely stupidly. They share the blame for her death.
what you are saying about Natalee having alcohol poisoning may be true – but if that was the case, Joran's father would not have panicked and said get rid of the body, especially for becoming a judge...regardless, once may be an accident, but twice? come on, twice is a pattern...who beats up someone (and then kills) for reading an email...
hi nancy, have u looked at joran's facebook info? one of them has the name bobby mcredible. it has his pic and if he really posted this info that goes to show how sick of a person he is. another thing is if im stuck in a room with someone who is a murderer, the last thing i would want to do is hit the murderer. i would try to stay on his good side so i can escape as soon as i get a chance. i dont believe anything van der sloot says.
I believe that Natalie overdrank and partied the last night of her stay in Aruba, and since she was as an adult, there was nothing any chaperone could have done.
Having said that, there was and is no excuse for ANYONE, whether they are seventeen or seventy, to take advantage of ANYONE in that situation. PERIOD.
This man KNEW what he was doing was wrong, and like most men, he took her to a deserted beach because he wanted to have sex. Whether he raped her or not, whether she died of accute alcohol poisoniong or not, whether he killed her for the fun of it or not, we will never know, because this man is a known liar and has been sheltered by his "prominent" Dutch/Aruban family.
I hope his father is rolling in his grave and his mother feels shame and guilt every day of her life for raising this worthless piece of flesh. If he hadn't been spoiled and rescued for his mis-deeds every step of his childhood and adulthood, he might have turned out differently.
Whether he killed Natalie or not doesn't matter. What matters is that he did get caught red-handed killing a young Peruvian woman from a prominent Peruvian family and he WILL pay for that in the jails of Peru – The government has said he will NOT be spending his time in an Aruban jail.
TRUST me on this – he will live a life of pure joy in the Peruvian penal system – he will have the pleasure or thought (which is much worse than what happens to him physically) of being tortured, sodomized, beaten up or murdered every single day of his life if he is turned out into the general population. If he is kept in solitary confinement to "protect" him, he will go insane and live his life with no human interaction at all. I think either punishment is worthy of him.
Let's hope Peru sticks to her guns about not sending him to serve time in Aruba.
Beth Tweedy, God bless you; The family of this young murder victim, God Bless you as well, I can't even fathom what either of you are going through, and God willing, I hope I never do.
I have no words for your theory. It is truly amazing at how appalling it is. Yeah, he is a prince of a guy (NOT) and this is the 2nd woman to be found dead with him. Hummmm, yeah I would want my daughter going out with him because he is so misunderstood and none of this is his fault. Look at his expressions, he couldn't care less about these women.
Subject: Facts re J. VanderSloot
JVS's "friend" of three months said that Joran had a coffee shop in Thailand. I would think there would be some factual evidence to that fact. I wonder if any young women in casinos were killed or disappeared during the time he lived there. I wonder if his travels could be traced through his passport usage to see if the same thing might have happened during his visits or other anniversaries of Natalie Holloway's death? Thank you. Alicia B. 6/18/2010
I sure hope that this mess he is in, in Peru – goes through the system very quickly! I feel that him going to Aruba, to testify about Natalee, will not happen. VDS is still lying all the time, and mixings his stories up. What a creep!!
My great wish, is that justice will prevail swiftly in Peru, then the USA and then Aruba.
I really feel bad for Natalee's parents, but, I believe the main point here, is to get this person, off the streets and in prison, thus no other woman will have to suffer by his hands.
My heart goes out to Stephay's family, during this most terrible time in their lives.
So Sorry!!
No, he didn't quit because of threats. There was no threat.
He quit because he didn't think he was going to get paid.
After Anita van der Sloot promised him money, maybe from a book deal, the defense attorney saw the dollar signs.
$$$
I think 'Nadine Diem's' comment about The Holloways and press turning Joran into a monster would be hilarious if there were not two dead women involved. So a girl who has too much to drink on spring break is basically just asking to get burried in a shallow grave, right Nadine? You should be ashamed of yourself for insinuating that, and down right embarassed about your "the Holloway family made him a murderer"
My question is, who is going to pay off Aruban authorities this time now that his daddy is no longer in the picture?
Why does van der Sloot have access to a TV? Why does he get to play cards with a fellow inmate? Those seem to be privileges that should not be granted to one arrested and charged with murder. Just wondering!
In reply to Nadine- the press coverage did not turn this man into a murdered/monster.
Even if your theory of her dying from alcohol poisoning are true- he is still a monster for disposing of her body and not calling police/medical help. He did that before he had any press coverage.
He's a bad seed. Needs to be locked up or put to death for what we know he did to Stephanie & want he probably did to Natalie. I hope Peru keeps him & someone beats the crap outta him in that filthy Peru prison!
gosh, Nadine, it must be nice to never make a judgement error....a nice guy ever try to pick you up? Or a nice woman, for that matter? People make mistakes, but few pay for their mistakes with their lives. shame on you for blaming the victim. You belong in that group with misagynous men who hate their mommies and kill women because they never worked it out. Did your daddy bonk you?
this guy had a lot of help to get off the first time....everyone who helped him beat justice in the Holloway case shares the guilt that he was able to kill another innocent girl..... he should rot in jail for the rest of his life period.
I originally heard that Joran paid two weeks in advance for his room when he left and told the staff not to go in the room. Then I heard on your show the other night that the staff entered the room because he had not paid for it in two days. Which one of those is correct? It's a curious issue because, if he paid for two weeks in advance, there poses the question of where did he get the money?
your saying he was just a kid, but at 17 you know what your doing and you are old enought to reason.
Another thing if this was created like YOU say then howcome he killed someone again.. ? THANK YOU!
I believe this guy has serious issues and should get psychological help. 1st one a mistake and 2nd one too? Nope!
Get real. And think about others and Natalees and Stefany's families, they must be in terrible pain.
I used to believe that Natalie Holloway died of her own bad judgement. But, i'm not so sure anymore. I think this guy killed her. How many more girls has he killed?
Nadine, what an idiotic opinion. Your speculation as to what happed to Ms. Holloway is pure fantasy. Since this monster admitted to killing his LATEST victim, it is no stretch to believe he's done it before. Don't cast dispersions on someone you don't know. With this coverage, we all KNOW Van Der Sloot. He's a murderer.
Amazing the ignorance of those that can condemn the new but not listen to it, for the facts show that this man was labled a predator by the locals of Aruba prior to the murder of Natalie Holloway. A date rapist that drugged his victims.
Did Natalie probably drink and party too much, yes. Did she deserve to be taken advantage of and buried in an unmarked grave NO. This psychopath was NOT created by the media, it was created by his own inner deamons. I make and assumption that this young man was a spoiled child and had parents who never made him accountable for his own mistakes. Hence the cover-up of facts and the legal strategy of a father who was "in the know" that lead to Aruba's inability or unwililngness to arrest this freak years ago.
Psychopath and Sociopath. The murderer would have been in jail 5 years ago had his father not been a judge that manipulated the Aruba judicial system. The father dropped dead at age 57 a few months ago. Maybe there is some justice. Don't believe that Natalie Holloway had an alcohol induced seizure and she died. Criminals like this guy will try to lie their way out of everything. Peru will take care of him now. Too bad there is no death penalty in Peru. Hope he never roams free again.
If you had any idea of what went on in Aruba, you wouldn't post such tripe. Van der sloot and his cronies were putting drugs in girls drinks and taking advantage of them. He poisoned her, raped her, and when it turned out he murdered her, he tortured her family for years. To blame the victim and make excuses for this travesty of a human is reprehensible. He was a monster long before we ever heard of him, and a monster can't change his stripes or his stench. I hope you are so cavalier if a monster comes into your family someday. Creep.
In my opinion, of all the grief caused by JVdS, one of the saddest things is the grief he's caused to his own mother. She must be suicidal at this point, and heavily medicated.
That anyone can defend this man on any level or excuse him for his crimes is unsconsionable. The media and law-abiding citizens "created" this monster? What a sick, sick view. Morally bankrupt in fact. Even if he did not kill Ms. Holloway (and at this point I believe that he probably did), what was the purpose of keeping the media storm going with his fantastic lies over the years? And what kind of innocent attempts to extort money from grieving parents with yet more lies.
I hope he rots in the hell of a Peruvian prison for a very long time. I'm not usually given to revenge, but this smirking, manipulative monster deserves no quarter whatsoever.
Why such intense unrelenting interest in this case???????????? there are so many many African Americans young ladies whose death or disappearance never ever made it to the media let alone talked about after 5 months, yet Natalie Halloway after more than 5 years is still very much in the media, such double standard.
Her disappearance while so very tragic and unfortunate and i pray her that her parent will have closure one day and find solace in their lives.
The bible also states teach your children the right way and they will never deviate, charity begins at home as well.
I hope and pray that b/4 i took my last breath, i will see an America where everyone is treated the same, and their tragedy kept in the media with the same vigor as this, regardless of their skin color, not preferential treated for a segment of the soceity while the others are forgoten, that is the America i look forward to seeing one day, but i will never ever hold my breath on that notion.
Really? She was shaking and seizing, so his "judgement" call was to get rid of the body versus calling an ambulance. I'm sure he was thinking that he would rather go to jail for murder instead of be innocent and get a slap on the hand for being in the wrong place. No one created a monster. You are using alcohol as your basis of argument from a man that has lied multiple times about what happened to her. Maybe it's just me, but if I was with someone and that happened then I would call someone for help. Innocent people don't bury the body.
It is quite obvious that this is one troubled person and he needs never to be released on the public again.
I know that it would be hard for the Holloways not to want him to be expedited to Aruba and released from a Peruvian prison, so that they can find their daughters remains....if indeed he would tell them where she is or that she can be found. She could be in the water some where, never to be found, eaten by fishes or sharks...
But I for one, hope that he stays right where he is. From Arubas' past experience with Van der Sloot, they could release him and we would never see him again. He could be anywhere, Denmark, Spain, Africa and continue his killing spree.
I want to know if her is responsible for the other young woman who are missing in South America, who came up missing while he was in the area. They also came up missing from casinos.
I am surprised that Nancy Grace team is not digging into that can of worms.
Why not offer Sloot this deal: Show us where Hollaways body and you stay in protective lock-up. If you don't, general population
I have wondered if van der sloot killed her because she beat him at poker. she humiliated him and then he befriended her so he could have his revenge and get his money back. since they were sitting at the same table I suspect there maybe some truth to that. I wonder what the casino security footage would tell...
So many people get by with what they do for a while - but, it's a universal law - what goes around comes around. Finally, this evil man will get his justice in Peru.
Oh yea, we created the MONSTER! Right, how about his parents created the monster. Spoiled rich kid who wanted for nothing then kills these two young women because he didn't get what he wanted. He is right where he belongs and should have been there back when he killed Natalie. Had his parents let him suffer the consequences of his choices back then this young woman would still be alive.
Oh, better yet..... why dont you send your daughter to Peru and be his girlfriend? Maybe she will have better luck then these other two poor girls. I wonder what you will say when they uncover that he has killed more then just these two girls. I bet he left bodies in Thailand as well.
To all the armchair quarterbacks ... The Peruvian three judge trial process will not speculate it will look at the facts and conclude with an informed decision based on only the facts and no speculation. If I was on that 3 judge panel, based on the facts I have seen presented in all the informational sources available as of today I would issue the following decision.
LET IM FRY
Q.E.D.
Samantha, Very well written, I agree with you whole heartedly.
It's not ok to blame Natalee Holloway for someone taking advantage of her in the state she was in, and proceeding to murder her. I'm not disagreeing that she made a bad choice, but nobody deserves to be victimized because they made an error in judgement. And her mother certainly does NOT deserve to be victimized by him over and over again. You claim "the Holloways" created this monster – you should be ashamed of yourself. Do you know what it's like to have a child you nurtured, cared for and did everything for ripped from you? In my opinion Beth Holloway is to be commended. If she hadn't done all she has done, Natalee would have been swept under the rug and nobody would have known about it, and this monster would get away with murder.
Some things you need to consider are: Number 1 – even if his half baked story about her having an alcohol related seizure was true (which I'm sure it's not), then he's guilty of criminal negligence. You don't just walk away from someone dying. Then, in case you didn't see it, when he was being secretly taped in the Netherlands by Peter De Vries, he made the comment (the only one that I think he's telling the truth about) that they would never find her body, but if they did he would be in deep s–t! Now, if she died from a seizure, why would he care if they found her body. He cares, because he beat her to death too, and he knows if they find her skeletal remains that they will be able to tell at least part of what he did to her. That's brutal, but that's the truth!
Anybody blaming a victim should be ashamed of themselves. This monster had a choice, and he chose to snuff out the lives of two beautiful, intelligent and vibrant young women. And he chose to make the lives of their families and friends a living hell forever. I don't really care how bad Peruvian jails are – 35 years isn't forever – death is!
Natalie Holloway was the victim of Joran Van Der Sloot
to make it seem as though she was at fault for drinking, hmmm she had just graduated herself so she was young also and had a bright future ahead , Joran ended that so the monster created himself
Joran's father taught him quickly the meaning of "no body, no case." If they wanted to make sure it wasn't found, they'd put it there. My bet is that it is on the grounds of the Van Der Sloot home. The father knew he could prevent the property from being searched or delay it enough to move the body if needed.
My other bet would be in the ocean, considering the break-in at the fisherman's hut.
Why don't they search all areas that have not already been thoroughly searched? Start with the Van der Sloot home and the property Joran pointed out last....the lot where a building now stands as well as the bird sanctuary.
Other than that, I thought most of the island had already been searched. I know the dump was. Could the officials have been told to ignore/not report anything they found?
This guy should just kill himself.With what is awaiting him in jail from both inmates and guards he would suffer much less than he should.
Nadine people could call me a murderall day every day for 5 years but it would not cause me to actually become one. You either have it in you or you don't. He murdered two girls, period.
are you kidding, the "kid" is a sociopathic killer, this isn't over, there will be more bodies found or found missing in this piece of garbage's path. And to blame the victim is CRAZY and IGNORANT He killed her and many more no doubt. DUH,
The creep you had on your show (Ludwick) he said he was a friend of Van der sloot is just as bad as Mr. Van der sloot with that smug and laugh hope he just lost all his friends for acting that way he is really a punk. I truely believe the Kalpoe brothers are involved as well and they do know what he did that night (halloway case) there is"karma" comes back allways and those other 2 brothers are next in line they have just as much to do with it as Mr. Vander sloot and they should not get a break either they could have come forward at anytime in the last 5 years but they do not because they are involved somehow. The media should follow them around and drive them crazy and find out how they feel about all of this. They should not get away with this either. I feel for both mothers they lost there daughters to these punks. On your show last night it was very frustrating to make it look as if he is in a decent place as he should be in the worst prison or do not give him any special food and housing and he walks as if he is an important guy and really if he would just give the mom the location of the body then we all would not even care what happens to him or where he goes. He is a looser.
BS..you can try all you want to make Holloway" the victim and also the gitl from Peru. Fact is...Van der sloot did it!! Creeeep. My daughter said she he needs to have his balls cut off.
Seems my comment wasn't quite on the subject. Still think Van der Sloop is a creeeep and both girls were innocent. My daughter thinks his*****
should be cut off. Maybe the Peruvian prison will take care of him.
If this guy is really the murderer that he is accussed of being then a good punishment would be to leave him in this notorious jail that he is in and put him with the general inmate population. It sounds pretty scary to me. I do however believe that the two girls involved put themselves in the wrong places and in positions for something like this to happen. Sad as it is you just can't be careful enough these days.
Wow! If you check Facebook for Joran van der Sloot, you'll find there are multiple profiles, some with his real name and some with other first names and some with totally different names. And some of them are still posting daily entries.....does he actually have "fans", or is someone crazy enough to be impersonating him, or what. Many have this same pic in the green striped shirt! Some in English, some in Dutch, some in Spanish! Busy, Busy Psychopath we have here! Most are to girls, – some are old (high school, maybe?), some are recent, some are current, – I think the FBI already has checked these all out, but if they haven't they should! Quite an interesting plethora of information! Guess he misses his computer where he is not, he can't be lining up potential victims all over the world to the next strike!
I just heard Mike Galanos say that Joran's Mother clains her son was set up! That He is ' not a Murderer!' I see why Joran is the way he is privledge and denial.He is caught red handed with the bloddy clothes in Stephany's company and his Mommy states he has been set up? I can feel no symathy for this woman at all! He is a murdering MONSTER and she has helped him be this way. I do believe when Joran killed Natalie that Joran ran to his Daddy and he helped him dispose of Natalie..God forgive me for the bitterness I feel for this family but I feels so much empathy for Natalie's short life and Her Parents and for the Parents of Stefany Flores,,Life has become so cheap. God help us All Nancy.
Burn in Hell Jordan you sick puppy!
And....No one is turned into a monster. No one deserves to die because they drank with what they thought was a friend. Do you personally know the sicko NADINE DIEM or are you just one of those women that need to "change a bad man"!
Ughhh...the last poster blames the victim. What about the 17 plus versions of the death of Natalie that Vander Sloot told? What about his failure to disclose the whereabouts of Natalie's body so her family can properly bury her? Then the guy murders another girl and steals from her and leaves the country? This murderer is a sociopath and was not "created" by the media. How dare the poster blame the victim.
You are incredibly naive. Assuming, arguendo, that Natalee did drink and party excessively on that fated night, her actions do not warrant being dumped in the ocean, buried in the sand or Joran leaving her on a beach. At 17, he was mature enough to understand that she was in trouble if it inded was alcohol poinoning. Neglect is neglect no matter how you want to portray it. Which ever of the multitude of scenarios Joran has given, he is still at fault...for not taking her to a hospital and getting her assistance, for dumping or burying her body. You can't blame the media for reporting the facts and details. Joran's actions in the Natalee Holloway case and the Flores case speaks louder than any media source has said.
They are saying in Jane`s show that Joran`s mother is now trying to rescue her son with a gang of lawyers from Aruba.She better think twice,Joran revealed that his late father as helping bury the body of the victim in Aruba.This implies to me that mother has to know everything that happened with poor Natalee Holloway.This is the perfect moment to make a deal with Joran`s mother to see what she might now confess on the Natalee case.Her psycho son had to have told her everything.
I think the American people are much sicker in general than Van Der Sloot. Since this story broke I've seen nothing but bloodlusting, prejudicial idiotic comments and sentiment from the press.. not the least of which is Nancy Grace. I see it in my co-workers and in general comments on boards such as this. From Nancy's lips:
"His cell exposed in an exclusive tour that reveals a hole in the ground for a toilet. Reportedly nicknamed ‘psychopath’ by a fellow inmate, how soon before the alleged killer joins the jail’s general population and possibly faces new dangers to his own life?"
Who takes a perspective like that? Wanton lust for someone's life to be in danger. Sick individual, sick society. The vast majority of us need to take a really hard look at ourselves. Much more dangerous than van der sloot because at least he is unmistakably mentally ill. Your sickness is hiding in the shadows and disguises itself as normalcy.
Nancy,don`t worry.Stephany`s father is not going to let Joran off that easy.Jail conditions in Aruba will be hell for a psycho.He will not even tolerate a month.Anyone will pick a fight and I don`t think another prisoner will use his fist because of how tall Van der Sloot is.He can run but cannot hide.
This Ludwick guy is in Love with Joran.Look at this kids eyes,they look like psycho eyes.Ludwick might end up in Castro Castro some day also.
Joran can`t say he gave himself in at any moment.He was busted and arrested.His disappearing act with the I don`t care look and the hair color change is a dead giveaway.
Nadine- That's crap! Even if she did have a seizure, it's probably because he slipped something to her. Of course lots of teens party, but does that mean they should get murdered for it! He is a sick, lying MURDERER!. You think because people called him a murderer that he became one? What are you saying? You can't create a killer by calling him one. He lied over and over again about Holloway! Because he did wrong and his father probably covered for him. Who in their right mind wouldn't call for help if someone is seizing??? Even if that's how it went down, he's a killer for not helping her! Don't blame anyone but Joran for what he has done! He is a sick human being and deserves what he gets!
I do not understand your comments about Anita Van der Sloot last night. She is a mother, just like you and me. She just lost her husband. I am sure she is very upset with what her son did but he is still her son. I can't even imagine how she must feel. I lived with my family in Aruba for 2 years. Mrs. Van der Sloot taught my daughters at the International School of Aruba . Her middle son was in my daughters kindergarten class. I don't understand why you are so obsessed with Joran. I live outside of Houston. Murders happen every day here and we don't even hear about most of them. I am more afraid to live here than I was in Aruba where there is hardly ever a murder. I feel so sorry for all the families involved in this, even Joran's family. They aren't responsible for what he did.
He's a rich, pretty boy who got all of the girls. It's catching up to him now. The Peru prison boys are getting him now.
Does this story have to dominate every episode of NG? I'm tired of seeing the same information rehashed night after night. He killed both girls, he is in jail now..we get it OK !!!
But wait a minute. This is not about Holloway. Stop blaming the press.
Oh, come on. The guy is a killer. Likely his parents always cleaned up his messes before and he never had any consequences. As a result, he just kept getting bolder and bolder, thinking he was untouchable.
Who cares! Worry about your own life and of those you love.
it's always interesting that most male murderersm including serial killers, have mothers who are in denial. I wonder if it's the way they raised their sons that causes them to hate women. She has been defending him all along in the Natalee Holloway case. And the father, a judge no less, covering up a murder and possibly helping dispose of the body. A very sick family.
And classically these men have relationships with other women who describe them as nice and sweet. Did you see his drinking buddy on TV also totally deny Joran killed Stephany Flores?!! Another dysfunctional man. Why is it that so many women are killed by these men who feel entitiled to kill.? Is there any more news about the 2 missing Columbian women that Joran might have been involved with?
I'm pretty sure the mom knows what a psychopath her son is, but it's her son and she will protect him no matter what. HEY, nadine... you're a fool.
tHEIR MAY BE OTHER WOMEN !!! The world needs the oppertunity to see if they be other Women. So may thies FAMILY may have closer. I PRAY to GOD !!!
I think Joran van der Sloot's family knew he killed Natalee, but they just didn't want to face the shame and stigma. Joran got away with murder 5 years ago because Aruba authorities didn't do their job and gave Joran special treatment because of his father. In some ways I wish Joran's father was still alive so he can see his son get the punishment he deserved 5 years ago. The van der Sloot family know Joran got away with murder 5 years ago, but had the family not tampered with the investigation in Aruba maybe Joran wouldn't had killed another human being in Peru. Joran's mother is pathetic and she just needs to realize her son is a murderer.
They found him with date rape drugs. He drugged and killed Natalee to rob her for jewelry or cash. The only one who created a monster was Van Der Sloot's parents.
Hope, he dies in jail like a disgusting rat he is. Only a sick animal like him can do such a gruesome/horriffic thing. I'm so happy he got caught because finally justice will be served for this two families who are being suffering the deaths of their beautiful girls. I followed the Holloway case since the beginning and I will never forget the face of pain of her mother's. It was a really sad thing to see, heartbreaking..... At least, he should get the death penalty or live in prision so he will not be able to hurt another innocent.
Natalee may have had too much to drink that last night but that fact alone doesnt let anyone off the hook to be a decent person and call for help. Disposing of a body just to not deal with a potential problem or bad press for Joran's father is not an excuse. Joran has lied over and over about what occured that night and enjoys the attention he has been getting ...well until now. He has taunted officials and Natalee's parents with knowing what happened and then extorting money for the truth. The press didnt create this monster...the press isnt falling for the "sweet boy" immage his Mom wants to pretend is her son. He has created all of his own problems so dont lay this on a girl that should be alive and living a promising life....Oh and BTW, the press didnt create the same killer in Peru...
why keep waisting time and money on this loser. the parents can take most of the blame for giving him money to go to casinos when they should have been going to his soccer games.
Nadine - I agree with you. These are my thoughts as well and I just can't think of Joran as a serial killer. Yes, he murdered Stephany and I feel so bad for what happened to her and her family. It's a shame that things had to come to this.... I believe he lost control because of what she found out "Joran' connection to the Holloway case" on his laptop. He was scared and lost control of his actions. He shouldn't have killed her, but I guess when you're in the press for the last 5 years and people believe you killed Natalie when you "possibly" didn't.... AND lIe after lie doesn't help your case. I believe this would trigger him to go into a panic mode, thus losing control of his actions causing him to lose it, if what he said was true "that she was going to the police" etc. I hope he tells where Natalie' remains are "hopefully" they're located where he says, so that her family can give her a nice burial. God bless them all!
Nadine - I agree with you. I believe this is what "could have" possibly happened to Natalie. I don't think Joran is a serial killer - at least not at this moment. I just don't. Connect him to other cases, then my thoughts will change. But, as of right now, I don't think of him like this. What he did to Stephany was totally wrong and it's a shame that things had to come to this. I feel SO bad for Stephany and her family. I believe he lost control when she realized that he was connected to the Holloway case, especially when she said she was going to go to the police, etc., if this is true. I think after 5 years of being in the press and telling lie after lie doesn't help your case. Especially, when most of the whole world believes he killed Natalie. I believe he went into a panic mode and just lost it because he was scared. I just hope he tells where Natalie' remains are, so that her family can give her a nice burial.
Nadine,
You gotta be kidding me, this kid bragged about killing Natalie, that was his downfall, he is an arrogant spoiled brat. If he was innocent he should not have bragged otherwise, you have to be lacking in smarts if you fall for someone like van der sloot who is a narcissist on top of all his other problems. He thinks he is the man and he can do whatever he wants to do, it is obvious he hates women and considers them his lessers, so Nadine count yourself lucky for not being falling down drunk in his presence and have some respect for yourself and poor Natalie and Stephaney's families, if your capable.
Just wondering...if this is a repetitive behavior are there any unsolved disappearce cases of young women from other countries before NATALIE in Aruba?????
I too think she was very drunk and probably slipped a 'date rape' drug. She died from that...the rest was to cover up being involved. Yes, the media has made a 'murderer' into this person's pitiful life. I'll tell you that this system can ruin a person overnight in divorce courts too. I've seen this happen to good people.
I disagree with Nadine...You cannot state what she was doing..maybe she was partying, but that does not give someone a right to kill her...if what you state happened, then he could have gotten help..medical test would have shown if it was alcohol poisening or not. That does not excuse the cover up..those parents are suffering..God forbid that anything happens to one of your family members.. It wasn't the Holloway family that made him a monster, it was the coverup and the government that did not do their job..this could have been provented, quit blaming the victim's family. Put the blame back on the who it belongs to – Joran and his father and the governent. Looks like his father already paid the price for coverup..no maybe there will be closure for Joran..he needs no sympathy, he gave no sympathy to the victim's family..karma comes around.
Joran Van Der Sloot is a product of his parent's making. Any time you do something for someone that keeps them from suffering the consequences of their actions, you stall the process of them taking responsibility.
Joran is a selfish, narcissistic killer. He may well be a gambling addict, but he's a sociopath in that he has no empathy for his victims, survives off of the abundance and charity of others, pathologically lies, and regardless of the reason Natalie Holloway died, he should have gotten her help and made sound decisions...but he did not.
Joran's mother is in complete denial about her part in his "illness". By continuing to excuse his behavior, she prolongs his agony and prevents him from being responsible. Not that he can ever take responsibility.
He's a spoiled, rotton, sociopath that his parent's made.
If his father did help him dispose of the body, he probably died from the stress of being involved. He certainly knew with his legal experience what the potential consequences were to his career and his son's future. The guilt must have weighed heavily on him.
Kate
Samantha it is unfortunate that you have already passed judgment with no facts .... I thought that position/attitude was reserved for Obama!
We need to let it p;lay out and I think the authorities will come to the right conclusion and justice will be served in the end ... after we have the facts.
Yeah, thats probably how it happened Nadine. He walked away from the whole thing in Aruba and that magically transformed him into the maniac that tried to extort money from the Holloway's and beat the Flores girl to death for a few grand... Monsters are created because too many morons like you are in denial that they exist. Blame the victims, blame the press, but never blame the parents who covered for him, the neighbors who probably saw the signs,the friends who knew he was mental, or the little freak himself. The mere fact that you think it was reasonable for a 17 year old boy (who was also at those clubs) and his friends to hide the body rather than calling the police or a hospital or something, shows your a little 'off' yourself.
I think they should someone to impersonate an attorney from Aruba, tell Van der Sloot that if he confesses to killing Natalie Halloway AND reveals where the body is, that they will get him extradicted to Aruba, and they should have Peru agree to this. Then after he agrees and her body is found, they should all say "April fools!" You stay in a Peruvian prison for the next 35 years.... then we will try you for the murder of Natalie. Now that's what I would call justice.
Really? I can't believe people are so clueless to defend him. There is evil in this world and here you are looking at it threw this man. Natalee Holloway probably did drink too much, and if she did in fact pass out or had a seizure a normal guy would call for help, not throw her body in the ocean. My theory is he saw her drunk, knew she was an easy target, raped her than strangled her... then put her body in the ocean...Common people!!! really?
Before you witch hunters pass judgment and spas out let's get this case in court. I heard so many contradictions in this case I;m dizzy. Yes I'd like to see justice but to pass judgment now is too much. All I hear is he said she said.
I'm always facinated how women throw each other under the bus. Oh she got drunk, so it's her fault. She put herself in a bad situation, so it's her fault. Nice job Nadine. But you have no problem believing a pathological liar. How do you know he didn't slip her something? Or would that be her fault also? If she really did OD on alcohol, he wouldn't be in trouble. She was legal drinking age down there. So why didn't he want the body found. Maybe because he slipped her something she OD'd on or because he murdeered her????
Natalie was the victim. She was not at fault. I would like to know where the chaperones were when she left in the car with the Kalpo brothers and Van der Sloot?
There is a John Ludwick who lives in the U.S. in the same town this John Ludwick references as home. That John Ludwick shot and killed his wife, then attempted to collect life insurance on her death. I believe he was sentenced to prison for manslaughter, eventually. I suspect that there is some connection there (father maybe?), am surprised we haven't heard more about it. It might partially explain Ludwicks weird attitude toward Joran, maybe he has been taught that his dad was rail-roaded by the press for a "murder" he didn't commit.
In fact, one of incoming message on the younger Ludwick's facebook page ( before the interview with NG aired) said something about "you better hope they don't find out about your dad"...
He is lying. His murderous team made the body disappear from the beginning. They knew no body no charges. He is lying ,trying to get back to Aruba anyway he can.
Let's hope this doesn't ruin this poor attorney's career or life by defending an indefensible client. Notoriety is a scent that doesn't wash out easily.
Lock him up and fa-getta-bout-him... or lets go eye for an eye, and break his neck. Either way it's justice well served.
If it is true that van der Sloot talked with a man before killing the Peruvian girl, which he then called again after the murder, then I think he planned in advance to kill her.
I think he killed the Peruvian girl, planned to have his male aquaintance hide her body, and pull an extortion scam, on her well to do parents, like the Holloways, after the Holloway extortion plot fell through. I feel poor Stephanie's death was for money, what she had on her, and the money extorted from her parents, in trade for letting them know where her body was going to be, but again he failed.
I find it interesting that people accept Van der Sloot's description of Natalie's death as "seizing", when everything else he has said is considered a lie.
I think he picked her out in advance and had pegged her a a good victim to kill, so he could later extort money related to her death.
Creation??? That's ridiculous! People should be held responsible for their own actions. The fact of the matter is that Van der Sloot killed both of these women; all evidence and confessions point in that direction. He needs to be held responsible and either face the death penalty or spend the rest of his life in jail. And whatever happened to being held responsible for LYING multiple time to authorities??? That in and of itself should hold him in a cell for the rest of his life.
yes it was poor judgement but what are saying that because he is 17 in sports good student daddy the judge moms thinks son dont do enerything wrong so we say just dont do it again.NOT MAY HE FRY IN HELL
even if the previous commented was correct that natalle hollaway was a victim of her own bad judgement. It doesnt excuse what he has done...if u believe the story was shaking from alcohol gee...should i call 911 or dispose of her body? You know right from wrong at 17. Secondly what does this have to do with the FLores girl, whose murder he has been charged with.
Joran is a manipulator who killed the Peruvian girl and also killed Natalee Holloway. Joran is a image sociopath who desire's nothing more than being seen while at the same time gets his rockers off by killing females and trying to see how long he can get away with it. He needs to be isolated from the rest of the general population while in jail for the main reason that his status while he is jail will elevate him to a higher plateau where he will most likely have a following a following that will like all jails have links to the criminal world outside that will allow Joran much more resources to commit more murders than he did before.
What goes around comes around. He killed the teenager as did he kill the Peruvian girl. He WILL get what is coming to him from the justice system. I am glad to see this criminal off of the streets!
–Rusty
I also agree that Natalee Holoway was a victim of her own judgement but also her own parents are to blame. NO parent should let their teenage daughter go unsupervised in another country. Where were the adults, all those teenagers coming and going in another country unsupervised, who does that! I also believe that Stephany is not getting the air time she deserves, She was also a victim.
The hit man friend of van Der Sloot in the Peruvian prison..could he be a policeman planted to make friends with Joran to learn things about what happened to Hollaway??? Has anyone checked up on the validity of this person??
May he burn in hell. @nadine D. If someone starts shaking and seizing from alcohlol poisioning, you call for help. You don't dump her body. He is guilty as hell and he will pay. He will probably die in prison before he gets to trial. I hope he atleast tells the poor Holloway family where he dumped her body so they can bury her with dignity.
I don't know what happened for sure that night, but I do know that if he'd told the truth in the first place instead of hiding behind his father's power, it would have been a lot easier for everyone. Maybe he didn't kill her and maybe she did die from alcohol poisoning–he only needed to come clean about it instead of hiding the body. Post mortem blood tests would have very easily revealed the cause of death and exonerated him. Instead he hid the body, denied being with her at all, then when pressed lied about where they went and what they did. He's made "confessions" then taken them back over and over. How exactly am I supposed to feel sorry for this supposed victim of circumstance?
Think about how it would have played out if he'd told the truth in the first place and not tried to hide anything (including the body)–especially if he was only present for the overdose. He might or might not have served a brief sentence and it would all be over now. Instead he behaved like a guilty man in every respect.
I am really surprized, that there is so much fuss about the floor toilet! In all Eastern countries, it in the same. India, Thailand, everywhere.
In fact, all those people sitting on their haunches, selling things, go right there, and wipe with their hand.
Even many hotels, are the same, but some do have toilets. When China had the Olypmics, they spent a lot of time and $$$ changing the toilets to suit Westerners. My family took several cruises to the East, and we always made sure we went, before we left. But, sometimes...... and I recall going into a very fancy hotel, in pink marble, and the bathroom had just the holes, but within easy access to water tap. But, there are places to stay, that had western facilities! So, if people are grossed out by this, guess you better not travel too far East.
P.S. And, be careful when purchases all those cheap deal on items!!
Why did none of the guests in the hotel hear Stephany's screams? Also, is there any surveillance footage that perhaps shows Stephany lending money to the Joran while he was playing poker? I believe that one rational explanation for her following Joran to his room was because she may have lent him money while he was playing poker and he promised to pay her with money he claimed to have in his room....
so you only brought up the natalee holloway case nadine. are you still going to deny the fact he is a murdered even though he CONFESSED to killing the peruvian woman? shame on you.
Nadine, even assuming Natalie WAS an accident, her mother referring to him as her killer would in no way would make him capable of doing what he did to this girl! Maybe if Aruba had listened to Natalie's mom this incident in Peru never would have happened.
I agree completely with Nadine! I have thought the same thing for a long time. Natalie got wasted on alcohol and probably drugs and went off with a guy she didnt know doesnt sound like an upstanding young woman to me!. Hate that she had to pay the price for her stupidity and lack of morals with her life but let it be a lesson to all women to not be that ignorant.
We need to get Van der Sloot here in the USA. Him spending the next 30+ years in a peruvian prison will not be as bad as most people think. Watching the Nat Geo doc about the Peruvian prison only the poor and very poor suffer. Those with money (I'm sure Van der Sloot's family will be sending him money) live well in the prison. Those with money will have better accomodations, better food, protection and entertainment. Inside the prison it's like a small town. Van der Sloot will walk freely inside the prison walls. He will shop, gamble and even have women if he so chooses. In a Aruban prison he would be treated even better... And we are not even talikng a large sum of money. Just a few hundred dollars a month and Joran will be on the top of the food chain in a peruvian prison. Pay enough money to the right people and he will just walk out of the prison and go any where he wishes never to be found again. Van der Sloot belongs in a American prison where we know he will not get any special treatment and will serve some really hard time. Just my thoughts. w in california
it's hard to win this one. this Joran is already convicted by the public .
a never concluded case involving an American girl made the American media go. the Peruvian girl seems to be forgotten and it's all Holloway now. because of the publicity around this one it has gotten difficult for Dutch to travel to Peru ( don't mention the case to a drunk over there being a Netherlands citizen) . the case has gone over the top . the details are not being seen anymore.the media's gone far to far. the police knows that there are things going on far more cruelsome and they are not being heard. it's politics and money now. sad thing!
The death of Ms. Holloway is best categorized as another alcohol related tragedy. Bars are full of predators waiting for their next prey. Alcohol use is not safe, period!
I hope this a**hole and his fans, go straight to hell where they belong, they are already making stories to make him look innocent....morons!!!
Nadine, I disagree on your assessment that "people" created a monster or murderer in Joran. If Natalee really had died of alcohol poisoning then he would have had NO reason to hide her body as she had been observed in the bar drinking by many people. It would have been considered just and accident. The fact that he did hide the body says that there was more going on that just her drinking....a lot more in my opinion. Joran is what he is and no one made him that way but himself.
Nadine,
You are blaming the victim and I totally disagree with you. Since Urine has a history, along with the Kalpoe brothers, of using date rape drugs on unsuspecting girls, has it ever crossed your mind that she was drugged and that's why she had the seizure? I've never heard of anyone having a seizure after drinking too much, people usually have seizures when withdrawing from alcohol.
Urine has been a pampered brat his whole life. When he couldn't get what he wanted (probably sex, maybe money) then he had a tantrum and killed her. Bottom line – Urine is a cold blooded killer and it's not Natalie's fault that she's dea.
Nadine: Wake up! He almost had me fooled , too. I thought..too many ifs...but evidence is evidence..surveillance videos are proof! I believe the computer is going to tell the story. Possible he may have left it open; went for the coffee; came back and saw she was googling him; and he flipped out! He's a psycho! To Peru: put him in general population..they'll save you time and expense. He deserves his fate! He is a worthless scum-bag!
To Nadine: If Natalee died of alcohol poisoning, yes, he is not a murderer. However, if that is what occurred, he hid a dead body and did not report the death to authorities, which is crime. The media did not make him into a criminal, he and his father accomplished that on the night they disposed of a dead body and continued to cover up the circumstances of a person's death.
I just read an article yesterday where he had trashed an apartment with all of his partying and the landlady went to the embassy to complain and was reimbursed $2K for damages by his uncle. There will come a time when borrowing money from friends/family is going to run out. Then what is the family going to do. Get yourself tested and the rest of the siblings, change your name and go live in a cave somewhere. Let Peru finish what Aruba and the parents failed to do. My condolences to the families who have lost the daughters to this piece of trash.
Yes Nadine, he's at heart a really good kid with bad judgement. That's why he keeps changing his story about what happened to Natalee
and why he tried to shake down her mother for $250,000. And all that bad press drove him to go to Peru and kill that girl. But maybe she just slipped and hit her head several times and once again "he was frightened" and "did not want to deal with it," and instead grabbed her
money and ran, like any crazy but loveable young sociopath.
Your kidding ! This guy is a killer and your blaming Natalee and the media. You need to have yourself check out
Certainly Natalee exercised bad judgement, but even if her death was accidental due to an overdose of alcohol or drugs, if Joran was with her at the time, he had a duty to report the death. Had he done so, and been completely truthful about the events, it would have been tragic but not criminal, and Natalee's family would have been able to bury and grieve her properly. As it is, he is perhaps guilty at least of concealing her death, disposing of the body, and lying repeatedly to authorities. Giving him all the benefit of the doubt, it is not impossible that the guilty or noteriety or stress of the past 5 years have "created the monster" but he is not blameless. And, it is pretty clear that he is absolutely, unequivocally guilty of the murder of Ms. Flores - another tragedy that would never have happened if he'd come clean on Natalee.
The best thing that could happen for vanderslash's mother is for the authorities to go ahead and put him down his mother is just doing what any mom would naturally do and in this case its a shame his antics have already lead to his fathers demise!
I feel terrible for the families of the victims but I for one am sick of this guy getting all the coverage. What happened to the precious little childrem, Cummings, Anthony, is nothing new going on with those cases are is it this guy becomes the star? Whatever happens to him happens. It's heartbreaking that some times the victims cause their own fate. Drinking, partying in a strange country which she should have never been allowed to go to if the parents were so protective, the other one went to the hotel room with him, for what, tea and a danish? My concern is for the children who had no choice in what happened to them and hope the parents of those children pay dearly for any part they had in their death. I think we've all known "camera hogs" in our life, that's what we have in a lot of these cases. I didn't come to this site for four days, when I finally came to see what's new, nothing was. Look at all the topics, 98% are of him. I think if all that can be reported in this Van der Sloot bs, don't report anything for a while.
Nadine...you gotta be kidding us here. What about this poor boy extorting $25,000 from the girls parents saying he will tell them where Natalle' body is. He also admitted to killing Stephany Flores, and you think the press 'created' this monster. I think you are Mrs. van der Sloot using a fake log in name.
Nadine – No matter how you put it, getting rid of a body and not seeking medical help are both signs of low moral character. Yes, Natalie partied too much but did she deserve to die for it? Did the press and Natalie's mom "create" this murderer? If someone deliberately doesn't seek help and then hides the evidence then the murderer lies within.
This pampered, silver spoon deserves to be in the Peruvian jail for a very long time. Tis a pity correctional facilities in this country aren't held to the same standard.
As a side note: Nancy Grace exemplifies what is wrong with journalism today. She's more worried about her own self importance and telling the story as she sees it than just following the facts, printing them and letting the reader develope his/er own hypothesis.
Nadine, your post is a classic. Your ability to make lite of murder is truly remarkable. And your ability to say poor Joran, the evil press and that bad Holloway made you kill twice... just makes my head spin.
Addressing Nadine's opinion up there, I'd like to say that even if she did, in fact, drink too much, it's not up to URINE van der Sloot to take life and death into his own hands. You've really come up with some creative thinking there. Blaming the victim is a wonderful method for perpetuating assailants' behavior. That his father was an attorney and he grew up priveleged only bolsters the idea he needs to make the most use of his resources and practice humility and grace, even in the face of a frightening circumstance. He should have called for assistance IF, AND IT'S A BIG IF, that convenient story is true. People aren't just born callus and heartless. They learn it. HE learned it and is simply an undisciplined brat who's coping skills lend him to viscious acts. What a filthy pig he is and you are for excusing him. Clearly the standard to which you hold people is skewed. It's my opinion you need some serious therapy.
To Nadine -
How have the press or Natalie's parents create a monster or a murderer? Like you said thousands have gone down and partied way to much – i'm sure some have gotten sick and even had seizures – but most people then call a hospital, someone to help. A vast majority of people do not cover up someone's death because they panicked. I don't care how old he is/was or how scared – most people's moral and ethical boundaries do not have them hide a body, continue to lie about it, tell stories to make money and then kill another person. What happened with Natalie and the press surrounding it did not all of a sudden create someone who had no qualms about killing. What about his dad – blew his son off because he didn't want to deal with it? It might affect his appointment? What kind of father is that? That is absolutely insane to me. If she died from alcohol poisoning wouldn't it reason that he would have more of a willingness to get her help. He is a sociopath – only concerned about advancing him – no moral or ethical walls to make him concerned about others. The press might be guilty of perpetuating a story, but in no way did they "create a monster...murderer."
Not all teens go around and kill, but this issue of "lack of remorse" is rather commonplace in todays Western societies. Didn't we all hear kids killing for a pair of expensive sneakers or some expensive gagdet, not to mention how bullying turns deadly many times, parents being beaten up by their own teenagers etc. etc., and let's not forget about school shootings in our own country. I'm not a sociologist, but I believe that the a lack of intact families, the lack of growing up in the same communities, the lack of any spiritual believes contribute to this epidemic of angry, impulsive young people committing very serious crimes and not understanding "what the big deal is about".
I don't know about Joran's motivations, but he is surely not the only one with not understanding that "getting angry" doesn't justify violence.
Thank you
Their is no doubt that this young man is responsible for the death of both girls. A spoiled young man who seems to be calling all the shots. It's time to shut him up and put him away.
I agree Natalie Hollaway was guilty of being not too bright. Whether it was drinking too much and dying of alchohol poisoning or going with a guy. All I know is that if my teenage girl said "daddy I want to go to aruba on my senior class trip", my response would be "b-, you're out of your mind". That being said, that guy came up with 6 different stories as to what happened with natalie hollaway. He's guilty. I hope he dies in peru.
Nadine Diem . .says "I beleive Natalee Halloway wasa victim of her own bad judgement."
SAY WHAT!!!
Have you ever heard about the feminist movement .
Talk about inequalities.
Just maybe ..you might want to make a statment based on hard facts rather than speculation.
I find it very interesting that your Scenerio of the events has you convinced that Jordan was a VICTIM and that you believe he was justified in not wanting to "DEAL WITH IT" and got rid of the body because he was just 17 at the time was going to school played on sports teams and was a good student..
OH and when you say "DEAL with IT" .
You were refering to Natalee.
How very sad that you lack and compassion for another human life.
Natalee was a good person and ALSO A student with a promising future.
It's rather intersting that you express selective empathy for Jordan ..but lack any for Natalee Holloway .
There are many possibilities as to what really took place in the murder of NATALEE.
Lets assume that Jordan did in fact PANIC but it does not explain why he has refused to take responsibilitiy for his actions .,,
WHY because Jordan's own interests were at stake".
If this scenerio is true and as you have indicated Jordan is a GOOD PERSON and the sense of right and wrong and is concerned with the judgment of the goodness or badness of human action and character.
Logically speaking he would confess and morally do the right thing
so both family can start to heal.
Another scenerio could be that Jordan used the date rape drug . He could have raped Natalee. She may not have been dead but his own interests were at stake" and he got rid of her. This is still MURDER.
Another scenerio could be that Jordan slipped her the date rape drug , raped the TRUE VICTIM and then Murdered Natalee Halloway.
However, it could JUST be that Jordan is a PSYCHOPATH
based on facts rather than assumptions).
JORDAN has a history of using Manipulation , Violence and intimidation to control others and satisfy his selfish needs.
Jordan ( from exgirlfriend interview ) has also revealed another side , that to be intelligent and highly charismatic, but display a chronic inability to feel guilt, remorse or anxiety about any of his actions.
Jordan own interest was at stake , when he planned to killed Stephany Flores for her poker winnings.
Jordan needed money to get back to Aruba.
Jordan Van der Sloot wants to talk with Aruba Police about Natalee Halloway
ONLY because of his OWN interest is at stake. .
Jordan is responsible for his own actions and this time he cannot manipulate the legal system of Peru.
I think you are right on Nadine, or close anyway. Lets remember
too the other girl in his room was walking around in her undies
and a T shirt when he came back from the store.
NO ONE "deserves what she got but i have not heard anything about this. It is like here in LA they always show a Killer Gang member
in his high school gown. Stephanie holding her teddy bear.
Nadine,
If in fact she died from alcohol poisioning, it would have been better for him to call the police, and I would think his father would have wanted that too if he was such a smart attorney and going to be a judge. She was seen in the bar and everyone knew she was drinking and it would not have fallen on his shoulders as a murder. There is more to this.
It never fails to amaze me in this day and age women like Nadine Diem continue to be so stupid. Murder victims do not deserve to die. I do not care if she was stark naked and saying "ride me cowboy" she did not deserve to be assaulted and murdered. You are probably one of those girls that write these psychopaths in prison? Rolling my eyeballs.
Blame the victim. How about she was slipped a date rape drug and had no idea what she was doing? Funny the same drug was found in Flores car. How about his lies and confessions as well as trying to extort money from her grieving family? I think he's a sociopathic serial killer sitting where he deserves to be. Sadly, though I hoe I'm wrong, I don't think her body will be found. I guess by your way of thinking, Ms. Flores' bad judgment caused her death too. Wonder if that drug was in her system too?
As much as I hate this Joran van der Sloot, I am tired of hearing about him. It is the same thing everyday. The same pictures everyday. We need a change till something changes with Joran van der Sloot. I personally want to know what is going on with the Heleigh Cummings case. Surely something has happened by now. Or even the Casey Anthony case. When van der Sloot gets something in court done to him, then let us know. This repeating is getting old real fast. I am from Alabama and I do feel for the families of both the girls but I have heard nothing different for a couple of weeks now. I am getting bored with it. He has it easy right now and I want to know when he gets it rough. I depend on you as to what is happening in the Heleigh Cummings case. Please update on that.
Thank you, Linda Cagle
my comment isn't about this case its about the Eric gilford case, WHAT IF ANYTHING WILL THIS SHOW DO TO HELP THAT INNOCENT LITTLE GIRL THAT WATCHED IN HORROR AS HER MOTHER WAS BEING MURDERED. NOW HE'S DISAPPEARED. PLEASE HELP GET THIS FAMILY SOME CLOSURE AND FIND ERIC GILFORD
NADINE DIEM, you are a cold and insensitive person just like Joran and you must be a “Friend” to Joran to defend a person of his caliber. You have no idea what you are talking about, Natalie was drugged just like Stephaney so Joran could take advantage of them. That is why she was shaking and seizing, it was not alcohol poisoning from partying to much as you say but from being overdosed by the drugs that Joran used. We don’t even know if she was dead when the monster dumped her body into the ocean. You are the Frankenstein creator by the excuses that you make for him, such as he was frightened, he was just 17, played on sports teams and was a good student. How do you know this? And as you say, when he called his dad, because of an upcoming appointed to be a judge that Daddy did not want to deal with it, so it makes Daddy no better than the Monster. You sound just as horrible as Joran, may you, daddy and Joran burn in hell….
nadine, you have it all wrong. she was taken to their house. pa was partying. they murdered her. they gave her the drug in her drink. it was not alcohol. date rape drug puts you in a didderent frame of mind. or she never would have gone. plus his dad was a judge and phycos like him are con artists, they could fool you. have compasion, she did not deserve to be taken. he has been a preditor there long before natalee, god bless the holloway family
He is a true sociopath! I feel sorry for any young woman who ever came into contact with him! Seems like they all end up dead or missing. You can't believe a single word this guy says. If he were to say the sky was blue, I wouldn't believe it. He is like a liars, says whatever it takes to cover his skin!
And now that dear ole dad is gone, he is stuck on getting himself out of this mess! I wish parents would see that if their kids never suffer consequences they don't become great adults...they just become more manipulative.
I hope he rots in Peru! And I really hope that they find info on his computer. He is just dumb enough to have stuff like that. I also hope that authorities follow up on his where-about between Natalee & Staphany...I'm sure there are more victims out there. He can't control himself!
As his own father; the judge in Aruba stated, "there has to be a body" to be convicted of any crime. Now the father is dead, he has no one to defend him. He is a psychopath, or a serial killer, maybe both, his own mother states that "he has mental issues". I wonder how many other young women are missing, that he may have had some contact with and nothing has been done?
There are far too many questions that need to be asked, I think all the law enforcement and the international police should get togather and compair some notes. None of the gals would be high profile, only reason poor Natalie was, her family raised so much hell about it. Authorties should look into date rape drugging (imagine that) as well as cocaine, since both are easy to obtain among some of the young people...Just see who else may have come under his death grip.
Just some thoughts...
It's too bad Aruba didn't remove Van Der Scumbag from society when they had the chance. Won't happen this time though and there will be justice for all.
NATALIE"S HOPE
To Beth Holloway and Dave Holloway for their daughter, Natalie, missing in Aruba.
Dedicated to all the childred that end up lost or missing.
I HOPE your path home is guided by the candle light that I burn in the window since you have been gone.
I HOPE that the petal of the rose gives your head a soft place to rest, o matter where you are right now.
I HOPE that the steps I take searching for you are not without merit, whatever that may be.
I HOPE that the day does ot turn into night without some word or evidence of where you are at this moment.
I HOPE the energy lost on sleepless nights, walking the floors, driving the roads and searching beaches will be enough to bring you home safely.
I HOPE that no matter where you are that you know how much I love you.
I HOPE that if anyone took you and harmed you that GOD in His own justice makes them pay in their lifetime.
I HOPE that I can honor you just as you have honored me with your life by being my child.
I HOPE GOD gives us both the strength to endure where our paths have taken us and in the end if our paths do not cross as we like,
I HOP GOD enfolds me in His arms, carries me and gives me YOUR light so that I may carry on....
NATALIES HOPE...for all the lost and missing.
God Speed My Love
by: Linda Edwards Darden
July 6, 2005
*copyrights reserved
please get to Beth Holloway and Dave Holloway for me. Thanks, Linda
Joran's mother now says she doesn't want to see him if he killed Stephany. Says "I will not embrace him." The family is practically broke because they spent so much money on Joran's lawyers from the first two times he was arrested. No Daddy to get him off the hook now.
Nadine.... a victim of her own bad judgment!!???
He gave her a date rape drug that caused to have a seizer and probably came close to brain damage or death, he over-dosed her then he thought, Geee why does this crap happen to me, then instead of taking her to the hospital, he decides it would be more convenient to dump her in the ocean. I bet he never even took her vitals, just assume she was dead, but she probably wasn't.
Can't wait to see what general population does to him
Hi gang, I just read where Joran Vandersloot is mentally ill, (duh) he was suppose to have went to a mental facility but instead left a note to his mother that he was going to Peru. She said that he was paranoid and not making sense the last time she talked to him on the phone, but when you are dealing with a child over 21, you don't have a say in what they do, or where they go. She also stated she will not go to the prison there in Peru. I don't know the law in Peru, but regardless of your mental status if you commit murder, you still have to do time serving in prison, and you get forced mental help and medication. Often times, once a person is on medication, they are horrified of their past behaviors. Sometimes the person will be suicidal, and some suceed. But whatever the case may be, he definitely needs to remain behind bars for quite sometime, and sometimes people like him, stop taking their meds, and kill again or commit other crimes such as robbery. I still hated his attitude well if you get any more info from me you have to pay for it. I thought my God, you have told us all and more than we wanted to know-broke a lady's nose, then her neck and that he knows where N. Holloways body is, and LORD your'e like shut up already, I'm already shaking and to me it sounded like he was confessing, to two murders and your'e feeling like your'e in a haunted house LIVE, and he just rants and raves. His atty. quits, and does a reprieve and stays and your'e like holy cow already. His mother should of told us up front that he was mentally ill because the whole time he was making us think he was just evil, but all in all just the mentally ill status warns us far and wide, you see this guy, you take off fast in the other direction. Don't waste time of day trying to figure his mental status just flee, very quickly. You have been warned.
He obviously is the one to blame for the Natalie Hollaway murder and yes there may have been negligent activity on her part, but regardless, he was with her and did nothing to attempt to help. And now look at whats going on with him!!!!! He is a crazy, complusive, Addictive, controling psycho who believed that he could do whatever he wanted!
As far as his mother................... she needs to let him pay for his bad deeds and learn that it's not "Burger King have it your way!!!" She has other children she should be focusing on, and trying to eliviate the trama they have probably had to endure since all this began. There is probably still hope for them!!!!
Gah, he definitely has Joran-itis: Say one thing one day, change mind the next day. Sounds like they are made for each other!! ;P
She better get the money fast b/c her son is fixing to be transferred to the general population.
Nadine Diem: Natalee did nothing to deserve being murdered! Have you lost your everlovin' mind?? Joran VDS should rot in hell for the murder of Stephany, he is obviously a sociopath.
Nadine that is about the most stupid thing I have ever seen written. Yes thousands of teens party but they don't run into a man that kills them. Yes he is a monster. I supose you would blame a women sleeping in he own home and someone breaks in and kills her,that would be her fault.
No nadiene....what you have hear in this young man is a classic psychopath.
I think this guy is finally going to pay for what he had done to both girls. But both beautiful young women won't be laid to rest in peace until this guy gets what his deserve's. I can't believe that his father and the country of Aruba tried to protect this sick maniac!!! Who knows how many more women were victims of this man. Now that his father isn't around to protect him he isn't going to get away with these murders. And i honestly think he is the most disturbed person on earth!! Peru should take him to Aruba so he can show and tell what really happened to Natalie then he should be shipped right back to Peru and suffer the worst treatment ever!! I'm truly sorry for both families of these women may god be with you all and my prayers are with you and your angels in heaven.
See what bad girls do to you? You should just say the honest truth mister because there is no point in ruining your life for unlady'like girls, mmmkay!? Now, who goes into the hotel room of a stranger, I don't know. Let this be a lesson for all you little girls, listen to what your mommie taught you.....
There is one kernel of truth in Joran's confession - the fact that he killed Stephany! Almost all of the rest of his confession is a succession of lies designed to lead everyone away from the fact that he intended to kill Stephany for her money before they ever entered his hostel room. He is the son of a lawyer and judge who taught Joran the ins and outs of evading legal culpability or, in this case, the more serious levels of culpability. He became a consummate liar years ago and continues to lie at a fever pitch especially today in order to evade a life sentence in Peru for pre-meditated murder for the purpose of robbery. Every communication he was having the days immediately preceding the murder were to ask for money to use to go home to Aruba. He was desperate for money and I hope the prosecutors amend their charges to reflect this evidence and ask for a life sentence which will give hit men within the prison plenty of more time to get to him as if they really needed more time! With his death, maybe someone will come forward with things that they know or have heard. The Kalpoe brothers may have participated in the gang rape of a date-rape drugged Natalee and therefore won't divulge the truth of what really happened that night with Natalee. As for joran's mother, what a denier and enabler! She knew about her son's penchant for lying as well as his propensity for angry reactions and violent behavior. How does she explain the unresolved disappearance of Natalee Holloway and the fact that Joran and the Kalpoe brothers were the last people seen with her? She is definitely a mother in denial!
Nadine, I'm glad you choose to blame the victim in all this... it really speaks loudly.
"joran van sloot" is desreve it to his own life in prison for good !!! ... he is a monster and murder his mother dont need to help his attorney or all attorney dont need doing work for him no way because there video are enough evdience .. what he did it done period , no matter what how heartbreaking silence were pray for natalee holloway"s family and stephany"s family too
"joran van sloot" is desreve it to his own life in prison for good !!! ... he is a monster and murder his mother dont need to help his attorney or all attorney dont need doing work for him no way because there video are enough evdience .. what he did it done period , no matter what how heartbreaking silence were pray for natalee holloway"s family and stephany"s family too.
Yes, she is a mother, but an unfair mother. Only if she could humanly set aside her feeling and see the wrong her son has done to another mother's child. This woman has raised a son so poorly it is too late for her to her own wrong.
Nadine your delusional.Natalee was blowing off steam on holidays.A young woman having too much fun unfortunately met up with an evil demon diguised as a young man.I hope he feels the fear Natalee and Ms.Flores felt in their last minutes.Don't drop the soap Joran..oh wait...they won't have any !!!
Wow... blaming the victim?!?
Unless I'm mistaken, that's the typical rape defence too and the main reason for which that crime goes largely unreported and rapists get to walk around free commiting their special crimes over and over.
Excellent strategy. And a good way to make sure the victims stay down!
Natalie probably did make poor choices. None of her choices were capital offenses. None of her choices were punishable by death. The same is true of Stephany.
They may have been naive, or too trusting of other people. Isn't that a scary thing?.... this is our world... we can't trust people. We have to be wary of everyone we don't know. Sad, but true.
It's disheartening to see comments blaming the victims and their families in any crime. I believe that the people who kill are to blame for all the killing. Nobody else. And I'm not concerned about the killers family life, social status, background, education or upbringing. If you kill, you are a killer. Stand trial and be punished for your actions. The victims have suffered enough. In this case, they've already been executed. We can stop bashing them now. They've learned their lesson.
To Nadine,
I’ve read your comment and you have some goods points. And maybe, I’d believe the events with Natalee Holloway possibly went as you have suggested, if not for the second victim. I know of no one who goes into the kind of rage that this man apparently went into and violently kills someone over the fact that they used their computer without permssion. No one that is, who isn’t a psychopath.
It's to bad another had to die for SOMEBODY to do SOMETHING to this nut bag.
Dear Nancy: I have written to you so many times but have no response but I have a idea on this VanDerSloot case against Stephany Flores and Natalee Hollaway case, especially Natalee Hollaway case. 5 years ago when Natalee came u p missing and a witness said that they saw men in a pick up truck late at night dumping what looked to be a body in the dump, what I am asking is this is there a wetland near the dump site and could Joran and father could have dumped Natalee there and is it possible for them to look again to find anymore evidence on Natalee? Also, can the Kalpoe brothers be an accessory to the crime in te case of Natalee Hollaway? Also Can the Aruban officials and the FBI be held also accountable for not being more aggressive in solving this case especially now in the sting operation of extorting money from Beth Hollaway? Thank you and Keep up the good reporting and keeping us informed. You are a ANGEL WARRIOR!!
Nadine, the press did not create a monster; this guy is a piece of work and has conned the FBI and the police. What he deserves can't be printed as far as I'm concerned.
Right....someone will see this muderer as a good kid, good student, and he'd never hrm a fly, much less a person. He's a killer. "If", and this is a big if, he didn't have anything to do with Holloway's disappearence/killing, and "if" he didn't kill this young woman, then why does he have something to do with it? He's a killer. Regardless of the supposed "bad" confession, regardless of his "make believe" alibi, regardless of his "BS", he's a thrill killer. He will naturally claim that she caused it, that he didn't do it, that someone else did, that he's a victim and that he is innocent as the day he was born. Van der sloot is a killer and will never be anything but a killer. Stick his "rear" in jail and throw the key out the window. Try looking at him and asking yourself if you trust him to be with YOUR daughter, knowing that he's been connected to two murders. Then ask yourself is he's such a wholesome, upstanding, guy....
If you watch this kid reaction to most of the questions between his two victims, my personal opnion is he is a serial killer. He loves the spot light and has no remorse. how many woman have we not heard about that he has killed?
To Nadine – your judgment and logic is clouded and flawed. EVEN IF you blame Natalie for her "bad judgment" and her over-partying as the reason for her death, there is NO EXCUSE for the behavior following her death. When something happens to a person, YOU CALL THE POLICE. ANYONE WHO DUMPS A BODY IN THE OCEAN IS A MONSTER AND A MURDERER. Joran IS NOT a monster because of the media. He is a monster because a young girl died in his presence and the only thing he could think of doing is getting rid of the body. And why? Because you live in a dirt-poor nation that doesn't possess a real police force that lets murderers get away with murder all the time? And now you have proven that you would have blamed your own daugther if this happened to your family. That is one of the lowest things you can say. Nadine, here is what you need to do: fly to Aruba, get wasted, find a young handsome gentlemen, and find yourself in the bottom of the ocean, and then before you go to sleep that night, tell yourself that it was your own fault. Oh wait – that doesn't make sense. How do you discuss your own bad judgment after someone has killed you?
He may have been, "Tricked," but that camera over the room wasn't.
Really Nadine? Really? It was her fault that she died? If she was exhibiting signs of alcohol poisoning (hypothetically) he can still be considered her murderer. Having a seizure doesn't mean you're dead. IF, in your theory, he simply tossed her body somewhere because he was "a good student" and not a monster it means he denied her proper, life saving, medical care meaning he contributed to her death.
I highly doubt this was even the case. The press and the Halloway's did not create this monster, just exposed him. If it wasn't Natalee it would have been another girl, and then another, and then another, until he was caught. He is a miscreant and deserves to live in squalor.
So Nadine, a quick question. Let's just assume for a moment you are correct. Hollaman just died of alcohol poisoning on the beach, and he freaks out and calls his dad. Everything is good so far. A wise move on his part. Now at this point, he's done nothing wrong. So his dad (who is a judge and is not freaking out) tells his son to ditch the body and pretend nothing happened? That most certainly IS a crime. Why would you tell your son to do this, when he's done nothing wrong? An autopsy would CLEARLY indicate lethal levels of alcohol in her blood. Police would have a rich local's word against a middle class tourist's parents. It's a slam dunk. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. But I suppose it could happen.
Next. A year later, your boy tells Hollaman's family that he can lead them to the body if they pay him enough money. Why on earth would an innocent man try to extort the family of a murder victim?
And now a few year's later we have another dead girl who's last contact appears to be Van de Sloot. Again, he didn't contact the police and had some story about 2 guys robbing them and killing her. If you are innocent and have just been attacked, robbed, and your companion murdered, don't you call the police? Why flee the country? (FWIW, I too don't put much stock into his confession. I suspect that the Peruvian Police are not the most humane of captors). So now you have two cases where he has certainly not acted like an innocent man. While I suppose he MIGHT be innocent, IMO, it's much more likely that he killed these girls.
Wow Nadine you are too harsh. Perhaps Natalee did make some errors in judgement a fatal flaw of the very young. We all in our youth did things that we should not have. However her family has the right to the truth and to be able to give her a decent burial if in fact she is dead, it would seem so.
Perhaps in future "Senior School trips" need to be monitored because well they are still young and do make judgment errors.
It is unfortunate that now this young man however he really does need to tell the truth once and for all in both cases. He does need to take his lumps as he has created them. Yes his mother I feel badly for he is her child and she loves him. Murder or not a mother's love is the one constant most of us can rely on. It may be hard for her to come to terms with his obvious issues but she will.
Being in jail in Peru is the perfect place for this killer. Scum like this should not be allowed on the streets. Comments about what a great guy he is and that he never killed anyone, come on get a life. This creep being involved in two murder cases SO FAR AS WE KNOW OF seems to me that he probably was guilty in both murder cases. With the comments mentioned earlier that because he played sports in school, well maybe, he is not guilty and he was just a scared little boy and would never do anything like murder, yea right like that has never been said before. DENIAL, DENIAL, DENIAL
@Nadine – her mom believes she was slipped the date rape drug and didn't really drink and party that hard the last night. Her convulsions are consistent with a bad reaction to the date rape drug. There are other people who claim he gave them the drug. And there were dtae rape drugs found in Stephany Flores' car. he wouldn't have involved himself in a crime and dumped Natalee's body if he hadn't done anything wrong.
Van Der Sloot gave Holloway a ruffee. He had a reputation in the past of doing this. in fact his friends bragged about it. She became unconscious and they weren't abe to revive her. He dis[posed of the body to hide any evidence of poisoning Holloway and raping her.
I believe Natalie Holloway may have had a seizure but it was probably a combination of alchohol & the date rape drug that Joren put in her drink. The unconscionable fact that they would dump a body, who was most likely alive when they did so, and the fact that the Aruban authorities would do nothing about bringing him to justice speaks volumes of the slime that is the Van Der Sloot family and the Aruban government. Most normal people would have called the police or ambulance, knowing that it was a tragic accident, which is why I absolutely believe there was foul play in that case. He is a monster & his parents and the authorites that protected him are the ones that helped create that, not the media, and certainly not Natalee's parents. Actions speak louder than words and Joren's actions point the fact that this guy deserves to spend the rest of his life rotting away in a Peruvian prison.
In response to Nadine Diem's comment June 17th.
In lieu of his second alleged murder which he has admitted to, plus the evidence supporting this horrendous crime, the probability that he also committed some horrendous act against Natalie Holloway seems even more probable, certainly more probable than the totally hypothetical scenario that you have presented.
Nadine – It is very obvious that Natalee used poor judgment, but to blame the victim? Really? It is also common knowledge that Joran was a very rich spoiled brat and was allowed to victimize many tourists in Aruba over a long period of time. Only 17 & a good student is no excuse. If you want to blame someone it's not the Holloway family trying to seek justice for their "just 17" yr. old daughter. Blame Arubian officials - at least if Joran had been in jail for that MURDER, then he wouldn't have been able to commit another one. Even Joran's own Mother admits the guy is a sociopath. Really!
Anita van der Sloot has said publicly that she is abandoning her son to his fate. She is not going to visit him, and she thinks he is responsible for Stephany Flores' death. She also said he was supposed to go to the Netherlands for treatment at a mental health facility just before he ran off to Peru. So she knows how sick he is. She says she can't "embrace him" after what he has done.
Nadine: That may be the stupidest post I have ever read.
Natalee could been her own worst enemy but it is clear Van Der Sloot and his father; if he truly helped cover this up' were responsible for their own demise as well. They could have simply told the truth if all went as you describe. Plenty of other students have chosen to do so when others suffered alcohol poisoning. Many of those victims got medical attention and lived through the experience.
Covering up this death is exactly why no one has any peace. A simply honest confession as to the events would have cleared up the hoopla long ago.
Joran is clearly a lying sack of poop that can't keep his stories straight; has no qualms about severely injuring and killing women and is deranged. It is a shame he isn't in Texas where he could be put to death while the public celebrates.
NADINE DIEM...are you crazy?
I would like to know what planet N.D. lives on. No one made Joran a murderer. He is intellient enough to know right from wrong. He knew exactly what he was doing.
He probably felt if he got away with it once, he wouldn't get caught this time. He belongs in prison.
I feel for both families of the girls and his Mom, but he did the crime, he should do the time.
Nadine, regardless of what happened, burying people and lying about it is wrong, so he created himself. If it truly was alcohol poisoning then why would he be scared and have to bury her if he didn't do anything wrong. Natalee's family has a right to know what happened. Your comments are a absolutely ridiculous.
maybe this time justice will be served.
I am sorry, but I do not believe anything that comes out of the mouth of this serial killer, his fiends the kalpoes or his "mother"...Who's to say they did not use a date rape drug on her...2 girls that we know of now..how many others has he killed? This kid is nothing but a cold calculating killer..if you fall for his act, you could be his next victim.
Why has no one brought back into media attention the Kalpoe brothers? I have never stopped believing that these three men – both brothers and Joran – slipped Natale something with the intention of gang raping her. Wasn't that idea tossed around during the initial arrests of these three men in Aruba? I recall someone saying they (the Kalpoes and possibly Joran) had done this before... drugged unsuspecting young girls in bars in order to rape them. And what of Joran's activities in Bangkok? He quite obviously despises women...
i send me and my family loves to both familys for there lost but now its time for him to pay we will keep u in payer.
Hopefully a fellow prisoner will do this guy in; get rid of this scumbag. It will save the U.S. citizens some tax dollars !
The thought that the media "created the monster" is absolutely retarded. You sir, are a moron.
it is impossible to contact you or to even set up a e-mail address. i will have to find other alternatives. i think your coverage of vander sloot is very good, however his connection to the holloway murder and his father's suicide should have raised more questions. his story of finding women for men @ finders fee, sounds a lot like slave trade or prostitution. There may be a problem with this blog as any communication is sabotaged, I'll know if you comment on your show. there is a noticed posted stating that all comments may not be posted. if this is the case then all communications with in this city will also be deterred. e g SATX
nadine, your theory of what happened in Aruba is pretty much in concert with mine..except i dont think she was dead, i think they thought she was though mistakenly..her friends said she had been drinking 151, and he may have given her ghb, which combined can cause someone to black out and shake violently. im willing to bet it was his dad that helped him dispose of the body too..but if anyone created the monster, it was his father for covering it all up....
Nadine Diem are you kidding me!!!!! He was just 17...... Guess what when you are 17 you know the difference from wrong and right. How dare you state that the Holloways and the press created the monster. That idiot never ever showed any emotion towards what happened to Natalie and that shows he was a monster then and is now proven to be someone that has no regard for anyone but himself. Shame on you what if it was your family that is going through the hell the other families are.
Guess those of you who questioned his being a sociopath with Natalee now know better. His mother should not go to Peru. It wouldn't surprise me for a second if she knows where Natalee's body is. The other inmates should be complaining about a scum like him being there.
Nadine,
I believe you are delirus. Has the Aruban heat burnt every brain cell you have. J is a monster that has now murdered two innocent woman. And you defend hm while spewing vile thoughts about the innocent that have been brutually murdered. I pray you have no children or loved ones. You are a lost soul.
So Nadine, let me get this straight, nice 17 year old, good student, etc takes the advice of his dad to dump a body to hide all evidence his being with her ? That doen't sound like a nice 17 year old to me. Whatever happened to an annonymous call to... ANYONE to see if she could either a) be helped or b) found and given to her parents for a decent burial ? And then to put himself in a situation where a 2nd young woman's death is linked to him. Or are you of the mind that someone doctored all of the hotel security tapes to show him and only him entering and leaving the room..
Being falsly accused is not the basis from which to form a monster/murderer. I am certain history is full of innocent people that maintained their innocence and did not being a life of crime and murder as a result. Hmmm. I think if I was sitting next to an acquaintance that started seizing, I would call 911. If the kid died, it is obvious to determine what from. Why would Joran call his father and why would the father – regardless of his potential position – risk the life and welfare of another person's child if there wasn't something to hide? Think, think, think. What – because he played sports that makes him a model citizen? What about the lacrosse kid that murdered his gf after a night of partying and boozing it up? Lets just let him off the hook too because "he goes to school and plays sports". Samantha is right – realize what he is.
Nadine, the press did not create this monster. If she did indeed die of alcohol poison, HE CHOSE to not call the police when he saw she was in distress, however, I do not believe that it was all alcohol. I believe that he is a real sociopath. He has now murdered 2 young women and you feel sorry for him? Seriously? Nothing you can say can make this be ANYONE’s fault but his. He needs to be stopped. According to his mother, his actions obviously attributed to his father's death too. When will this seriously horrible man be held accountable? I find views like yours, even though you are very free to state them, very disturbing.
To Nadine – and I suppose Ms. Flores was suffocated on her winnings at the poker table and he was frightened and didn't know what to do.......you gotta be kidding. Next your going to be showing up in court in Peru wanting to marry him. Who's the creation.
Nancy, Nancy, Nancy. If i was of a criminal persuasion, i would hope a team of attornies qould show up for my defense, IF i was caught redhanded. That one for the sissy boy vanderslot is making his career on this one. The less said about the lil rich girl in aruba, at this point the better. Let that come out in court. Why ddnt holland just pull his passport when he was in Aruba, force him to go back to Holland? Wait his late father was a judge, heaven forbid if his son was set home. I gave up on most of the legal systems around the world, including ours, years ago. Oh yeah, NOW the mother of that sissy says he is mentally ill. She may be the mentally ill one. She raised a sociopath, who really thinks he is allowed to go anywhere he pleases and kill, and who knows, his trail may include other dead bodies, no one really kept track of his travels, and him still a lead suspect in the lil rich girl's disappearance. Oh well, i can almost forcast the outcome, he will be released to dutch authorities and sent back to holland to his mommy. It's the way the world works anymore.
Wouldn't it be a great idea to put Casey Anthony and Joran together in jail? Just imagine what they could dream up as a team. Might make a best-seller.
There are two very clear facts here. One ~ two very young girls have paid the price for their poor judgement. Two ~ Joran Van der Sloot has been involved in both of their untimely passings. Unfortunately there are many, many bad people out there in our world. As cold as it may sound, it does not pay to be too trusting. It is also apparent to me that there are many victims; Natlie, Stephany, their parents and extended famiies , the parents of Mr. Van der Sloot and his extended family, and ultimately all of us in the world that watch as this continues to be a media circus. I wish only peace for the families of the girls, realization of what a troubled individual Joran is for the remaining family of Mr. Van der Sloot and justice served for the part Joran may have played in the passing of such beautiful women.
Nadine Diem... If I have told you once, it's been a thousand times! You take the BLUE OVAL pill at 3PM.
Nadine Diem: I agree with you 100 percent. Something just doesn't sit right with this whole thing and I think it may be the fact that the murderer Joran is a product of what has happened since Natalie. I actually feel sorry for him as I do for the girls' families. There's enough sadness to go around. I feel a reasonable compromise would be for him to 'fess up about Natalie and the location of her body in exchange for spending the next 75 years in the Aruban prison IF he is found guilty of either murder.
As a Peruvian citizen myself , I do believe that Joran van de Sloot was
tricket to sign or say anything agaist his will. I personally, believe that a person is inocent until proven guilty.
JORAN IS HIS OWN EVIL CREATION!
As I am writing this I notice Van der Sloot on tv with that bad dye job.I wonder if he bought any other diguises at the dye store?His Mother says he is sick in the head and tries to tie that in with the idea that people accused him of murder in Aruba by gum!I think he buried the Holloway girl in the sand on the beach!Someone should track his itinery for the past few years!He obviosly doesn't watch Nancy Grace or he'd have known millions of people are on to him!
Hi Nancy, I am hoping this is the way to comment on your show. Here is my scenario:
Joran knocked on the room door with 2 coffee's and drew attention to himself returning to the room, hoping the maid would discover Stephanie dead. That way he could say he was out getting coffee when it happened. I don't think he was aware of the camera necessarily. Do we know if it is a hidden camera? I have been a advid fan since the o.j. trial. Thank you for giving victims a voice!
I tried to call the show and it doesn't ring and hangs up. 1-877=Nancy01 (1-877-626-2901) am I doing something wrong?
Nancy,
I have travelled to Aruba for 25 years on business. The Aruban people are the nicest, most hospitable and friendly people of any Caribbean island. It is an incredibly safe island by comparison to all.
One thing I've learned from my travels there is that there are many Spanish speaking people on the island; Dominicans, Venezuelans, Colombians, etc.. In addition, the local language "papiamento" is almost a slang of Spanish and any if you speak one you understand the other. For Van der Sloop to state that he did not understand what he signed or the language is a crock!
I say hang him!
BA
Nadine,
I am sure that you are just being a moron to get attention.
Really Diem? You're going to put the blame for this sociopath murdering someone else on the Holloways? I'm impressed by your ability to put together the entire scene of the crime without any real clue as to what happened. Why don't you take some of your clairvoyant talents and find yourself a life.
Joran killed Natalee, no doubt. The once prominent van der Sloot family is now off their pulpit and the family will suffer for years to come.The politics is so significant that van der Sloot's country is stating his innocence, even when the mother will not go as far as protecting her son. How telling is that?!?!?! Maybe she knows more than she is willing to concede at this point. Karma, fate or dumb luck, balance is beginning to be established on these topics in the southern hemisphere.
He killed her just like he killed the Peruvian woman. Justice will prevail.
I just hope that he pays for all of his crimes in a slow painful way! His mother is a fool, just like the dad was. His dad got what he deserved as well, if I was the mother, I would watch out! This SOB needs to disapprear permanently.
I think Nadine you could very well be right and NH died of too much drinking and drugs. However, wouldn't a decent, normal person call for help? How could he be sure she was dead and not in a coma? Utterly ridiculous to say the press coverage made him a murderer. He's a jerk with a huge sense of entitlement. No excuses for what he did by not helping NH and by killing Ms. Flores.
Give me a break Nadine! Lots of high schoolers party on Spring Break and end up passed out, some with severe alcohol poisoning as well–but usually don't end up with their friends/companions concocting lies and disposing of the body!! Get real!
I was wondering why they don't talk to those 2 boys that were questioned with Joran Van der Sloot when Natalee Holloway went missing, maybe now they will talk if they helped him get rid of the body. Thank You Diane Kluz
i think this lawyer is looking hype his lawyers status by representingthis slimeball.he was going to quit because of death threats lack of funds did not want to spend all this time in peru .whats his motive?????????????
Natalie may have been intoxicated, but she didn't deserve to die!!!!
I think he put the date rape drug in natalee holloways drink the night she went missing. Then he probably killed her. Behavior repeats itself.
As the saying goes, "There is some truth in all lies" I think the same thing happened to Natilie Holloway that happend to the Flores girl only in Peru he didn't have any help disposing of the body. Probably in a rage he killed Natilie Holloway. His psycoholical profile substanciates this. Even if Natalie overdosed, he provided the drugs and couldn't have her wake up and tell what happened , so he disposed of her. Don't recall that any of her property was recovered.
Since Peru has those cab drivers, I think they will tell the truth to lessen their sentences.
I agree with you Nadine,
I am not saying it was right of him to murder Stephany Flores either, but im sure he was pushed to the point of no return (guilty or not in the Holloway case) because of the portrait the media painted of him. No matter where he went he was the victim of vicious verbal attacks because of the media. I actually feel sorry for him.
Nancy, I have several years under my belt as a sworn deputy, and just as many years as security for very well known establishments (both as surveillance and uniformed armed). I ask you this because I can't believe not one else has brought this up. Please take another look at the video of Van der Sloot as he exits the room, knowing he has just killed Stephanie. People have stated he was putting on an act for the camera. Well my take on it is this....look again. Van der Sloot exits the door, with danish and both drinks in hand. He looks down the hallways and begins a very lame attempt to appear to be locked out of his room on the way back from getting his companion coffee. I believe Van der Sloot was hoping to have a witness, hotel employee or guest, see him at that time knocking on the door. I believe if a hotel worker had been walking down the hallway and saw this and let him in, the story would have been " the robbers must have killed her because I didn't return fast enough with the money". For whatever reason, after going to get the worker, he changed his mind and decided to flee. Just like the lame accusations on those hotel security officers in Aruba, remember? If he knew those cameras were there, I don't believe we would have seen that lame attempt at a cover-up.
If he does a good job then he will be able to make a name for himself. The most well known case is how The Boston Strangler helped F Lee Bailey become famous, over 40 years ago. Providing Bailey with many opportunities to defend serial killers. Perhaps even getting some of them off too, so they could go back to prey on society. And on their particular niches in particular.
carli and nadine it is you i feel sorry for, i hope you 2 never meet some piece of trash like this guy because your being so gullible will get you killed. if you want to feel sorry for some one how about the families of these murdered women. this is what this POS does ,and you are falling for it.
Nadine & Carli – I Can not believe you can even say that Natalie was a victim of her own bad judgement and then stand up for Joran . Nobody "created" Joran except for Joran. He is a spoiled, selfish, psychopath. As far as Joran's father goes, what kind of parent helps their child hide a body, especially if Joran did nothing to cause Natalie's death? Also, who cares if he played on sports teams and was a good student? May I remind you of Ted Bundy, who was extremely intelligent and even awarded a scholorship to The University of Puget Sound and volunteered at the suicide hotline. Joran is NOT the victim here and needs to be held accountable for his actions. Even if Natalie did die from alcohol poisoning (which I doubt) he could have called to get her help. Any medical autopsy would have been able to tell how she died. He has time and time again taunted the Halloway family by telling different stories and then trying to blackmail them for the location of Natalie's body. All the poor Halloway family is doing is trying to find Natalie. If it was your child you would do anything to find your child, or what at least what happened to them. I am sure the Halloway family has suffered more then you can even comprehend!
This particular prison is currently paying restitution for murdering prisoners they were supposed to transfer to a new area in 1992. The warden and other prison officials along with the military commenced a strike on the cell blocks to be transferred. The attack originated in a women's area and was planned to end on Mother's Day just to be even more cruel. It included grenades, sub-machine guns and other weapons used on unarmed prisoners. Pregnant and elderly women were murdered, beaten and guarded with unmuzzled dogs. Prisoners were executed in front of other prisoners. The injured were denied medical treatment and threats of harm were made against their families. The real shocker here is that The Peruvian authorities even care that a woman was brutally murdered. They may just want Joran to offer him a job.
Carli, Nadine, you are kidding right?
There is never never ever justification for killing anyone. The man is a narcicisstic spoiled brat who never had to suffer the consequences for his actions. It was learned behavior and I blame his parents for their lack of parenting. I blame Joran for committing two heinous crimes and assuming, neigh, insisting that he should not be prosecuted.
Loveistheanswer: agree with you. No one has a right to murder another unless it is a court of law. I feel so sorry for Anita and her two young sons. They will be accused of everything for the rest of their lives. One bad apple in the barrel doesn't mean they are all bad.
Nadine that is nothing but an excuse. There is no proof of what happened to Natalee but even by Joran's own account to de Vries' friend, on video, it sounds like she died during a rape. I think there is no mystery here, and that Joran showed us what he did to Natalee by reliving it with Stephany.
You could accuse some people of murder all day long and they would never do what Joran has now admitted to. Have you seen the crime photos. It takes a very sick person indeed, to do that to someone. He turned a beautiful, living young woman into a mess, and up close and personal, in that tiny room. No one NORMAL would be able to STOMACH it, and look how calm he is with his coffee. No one made Joran do this except Joran.
4- Jim Armstrong. U are so right!! I couldn't have said it better, myself. Thank You!!!!
I pray that Joran spends the rest of his sorry life looking over his shoulder in a Peru hell prison. Justices will prevail!! I heard that this low life is trying to get a millon dollars for a story. Oh please! Media who want's to know how he ticks,who cares?. Stop the madness and stop Joran. He is evil.....
i think he was framed